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	<title>Comments on: What is click fraud ?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/</link>
	<description>the mark cuban weblog</description>
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		<title>By: eric</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15627</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[eric]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Mar 2007 11:01:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15627</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hiya,&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I just came across this post while looking around for people to tell about ClickProtector.  We just relaunched our site and started a free click fraud monitoring service, along with our pay service.  You should check it out - www.clickprotector.com&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Eric]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hiya,</p>
<p>I just came across this post while looking around for people to tell about ClickProtector.  We just relaunched our site and started a free click fraud monitoring service, along with our pay service.  You should check it out &#8211; <a href="http://www.clickprotector.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.clickprotector.com</a></p>
<p>Eric</p>
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		<title>By: Ken Carpenter</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15610</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ken Carpenter]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15610</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Why do advertisers want to pay for clicks instead of sales?  What good is getting someone into the &quot;showroom&quot; if they don&#039;t buy anything?I don&#039;t think there&#039;s a robot out there willing to pony up a credit card number and actually buy something!One problem is internet outlets that rely on advertising dollars don&#039;t want to admit that their mediums don&#039;t work as advertising vehicles!  They&#039;ll sell you an ad, but they don&#039;t want to hear about it when the ad doesn&#039;t produce sales!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why do advertisers want to pay for clicks instead of sales?  What good is getting someone into the &#8220;showroom&#8221; if they don&#8217;t buy anything?</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think there&#8217;s a robot out there willing to pony up a credit card number and actually buy something!</p>
<p>One problem is internet outlets that rely on advertising dollars don&#8217;t want to admit that their mediums don&#8217;t work as advertising vehicles!  They&#8217;ll sell you an ad, but they don&#8217;t want to hear about it when the ad doesn&#8217;t produce sales!</p>
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		<title>By: Mitchell</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15611</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mitchell]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15611</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[OK, what if the advertisers collected/stored the ip addresses of the originating clicks and matched them for duplication?  That way, if anyone clicked from the same computer and/or ip address more than once, it only counts as one click? Simple!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, what if the advertisers collected/stored the ip addresses of the originating clicks and matched them for duplication?  That way, if anyone clicked from the same computer and/or ip address more than once, it only counts as one click? Simple!</p>
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		<title>By: Forex Trading</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15612</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Forex Trading]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15612</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Google has some advanced algorithm plus a lot of eyes looking into click fraud. Without it, their business is doomed. Without any guarantee to advertisers and this algorithm and tracking Google will simply be kaput. So for the time being, with their technology at least, the advertiser should be at comfort advertising with them. Anyway, if your tracking senses an abnormal traffic wave from one ip, then simply put = click fraud.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Google has some advanced algorithm plus a lot of eyes looking into click fraud. Without it, their business is doomed. Without any guarantee to advertisers and this algorithm and tracking Google will simply be kaput. </p>
<p>So for the time being, with their technology at least, the advertiser should be at comfort advertising with them. Anyway, if your tracking senses an abnormal traffic wave from one ip, then simply put = click fraud.</p>
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		<title>By: Share Trading</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15613</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Share Trading]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15613</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[By the way the link above to the &quot;click Fraud Index&quot; is DEAD.Here&#039;s the link:http://www.clickfraudindex.com]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way the link above to the &#8220;click Fraud Index&#8221; is DEAD.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s the link:<br />
<a href="http://www.clickfraudindex.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.clickfraudindex.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: Don Dodge</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15614</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Don Dodge]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15614</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mark, Good points. My original definition of click fraud (click bots, click farms, paid clickers, and click sabotage on your competitors) should also include the MySpace crowd clicking on each others ads. I have no idea how often this happens but it is a manual process so probably not too much. Even teenagers get bored after a while.Ads appearing on splogs or parked domains do stink, but how is that click fraud? The end user decides if they want to click or not. Most users close the browser in disgust. However, if they click on an ad...isn&#039;t that legit?I think I may have overlooked clicks on syndicated ads through AdSense type networks. I know the major search engines can detect click fraud on their own sites, but what happens when an ad purchased through Google gets placed on some random syndicated site? Can Google detect click fraud on that site? Hmmm...they could if the ad click redirects through their servers before getting to the ad destination site. We used to call these &quot;jump servers&quot; and I assume this is how they do it now but I&#039;m not sure.Simple analysis of how many times per minute an ad is clicked,, or how many times a certain IP address clicks on an ad, or historical analysis of click through rates, can usually uncover click fraud.On the other hand, the best kept secrets in business are the extent of credit card fraud, and cell phone cloning fraud. The credit card companies and cell phone companies don&#039;t want anyone to know how rampant the fraud is because it would encourage even more fraud. Perhaps the search engines and big sites have similar motives?What I am saying is that click fraud is relatively easy to detect and prevent. I know the search engines do this on their own sites. How aggressive they are about fraud on syndicated sites...I don&#039;t know.Any advertiser who still pays CPM rates for page views should have their head examined. Fraud in page view counts and spam sites generating useless page views is indeed rampant and does constitute a fraud...but not click fraud.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark, Good points. My original definition of click fraud (click bots, click farms, paid clickers, and click sabotage on your competitors) should also include the MySpace crowd clicking on each others ads. I have no idea how often this happens but it is a manual process so probably not too much. Even teenagers get bored after a while.</p>
<p>Ads appearing on splogs or parked domains do stink, but how is that click fraud? The end user decides if they want to click or not. Most users close the browser in disgust. However, if they click on an ad&#8230;isn&#8217;t that legit?</p>
<p>I think I may have overlooked clicks on syndicated ads through AdSense type networks. I know the major search engines can detect click fraud on their own sites, but what happens when an ad purchased through Google gets placed on some random syndicated site? Can Google detect click fraud on that site? </p>
<p>Hmmm&#8230;they could if the ad click redirects through their servers before getting to the ad destination site. We used to call these &#8220;jump servers&#8221; and I assume this is how they do it now but I&#8217;m not sure.</p>
<p>Simple analysis of how many times per minute an ad is clicked,, or how many times a certain IP address clicks on an ad, or historical analysis of click through rates, can usually uncover click fraud.</p>
<p>On the other hand, the best kept secrets in business are the extent of credit card fraud, and cell phone cloning fraud. The credit card companies and cell phone companies don&#8217;t want anyone to know how rampant the fraud is because it would encourage even more fraud. Perhaps the search engines and big sites have similar motives?</p>
<p>What I am saying is that click fraud is relatively easy to detect and prevent. I know the search engines do this on their own sites. How aggressive they are about fraud on syndicated sites&#8230;I don&#8217;t know.</p>
<p>Any advertiser who still pays CPM rates for page views should have their head examined. Fraud in page view counts and spam sites generating useless page views is indeed rampant and does constitute a fraud&#8230;but not click fraud.</p>
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		<title>By: Mikhail L</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15615</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mikhail L]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15615</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@Ken: People may want to pay-per-click for many reasons, not all end purpose of something is a purchase. @Mitchell: That would identify the most basic fraud, what about fraud done by zombie networks?Maybe the line is somewhere in between what Mark and Don are saying, at least from monetization point of view, not talking about the intention behind the click.If Google monitored which sites displayed their ads than if splogs and spam  sites were rejected, the financial incentive for them to be formed wouldn&#039;t be there and two problems could be solved at once. No more splogs and spam sites, and less click fraud.  While a splog !=clickfraud, it can easily be used as a launching pad for it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ken: People may want to pay-per-click for many reasons, not all end purpose of something is a purchase. </p>
<p>@Mitchell: That would identify the most basic fraud, what about fraud done by zombie networks?</p>
<p>Maybe the line is somewhere in between what Mark and Don are saying, at least from monetization point of view, not talking about the intention behind the click.</p>
<p>If Google monitored which sites displayed their ads than if splogs and spam  sites were rejected, the financial incentive for them to be formed wouldn&#8217;t be there and two problems could be solved at once. No more splogs and spam sites, and less click fraud.  While a splog !=clickfraud, it can easily be used as a launching pad for it.</p>
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		<title>By: Andy Beal</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15616</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Andy Beal]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15616</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If we&#039;re going to expand the definition so widely, we should also stop using &quot;click fraud&quot;. While some of these clicks are not welcomed, they are not fraudulent. &quot;Invalid clicks&quot; is a much better term.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If we&#8217;re going to expand the definition so widely, we should also stop using &#8220;click fraud&#8221;. While some of these clicks are not welcomed, they are not fraudulent. &#8220;Invalid clicks&#8221; is a much better term.</p>
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		<title>By: Craig Danuloff</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15617</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Craig Danuloff]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15617</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Turn it around. It doesn&#039;t matter who or what or where the click was generated. Any click that doesn&#039;t come with the genuine intent to learn about or buy the product is fraud (or invalid, I like that).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Turn it around. It doesn&#8217;t matter who or what or where the click was generated. Any click that doesn&#8217;t come with the genuine intent to learn about or buy the product is fraud (or invalid, I like that).</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://blogmaverick.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15618</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dave]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Aug 2006 11:05:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogmaverick.wordpress.com/2006/04/19/what-is-click-fraud/#comment-15618</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The problem is that advertisers are paying for the wrong thing. Many of the companies and people that place PPC ads don&#039;t want clicks, they want to sell a product. To eliminate click fraud, stop measuring clicks and start measuring sales. Yes, pay-per-sale is quite possible. Imagine if Google provided a way for AdWords advertisers to have customers buy using GPay and only pay for the ad if a sale was made. With the ad and payment system integrated, it&#039;s no problem to track whether clicks resulted in a sale. The Adwords algorithm would change to reflect the click-to-sales effectiveness of the competing bidders rather than the click-to-bid-price.Why would Google want to give up the sure thing of PPC? First, click fraud is a lot harder to stop than some people think. Google and merchants are losing a lot of money to it, and hand-to-hand combat with offenders is tedious in a market this big. Second, pay-per-sale would not be subject to the 14% (or higher) &quot;click fraud tax&quot;. That makes costs lower for Google, the merchant/advertiser, and the customer. The three of them can divide those savings rather than giving them to criminals.The existence of PPS doesn&#039;t mean that PPC goes away, because there are some things that can&#039;t be measured by hard sales. However, if a product *can* be measured by sales it&#039;s almost a sure bet that it *will* be more efficient to advertise using PPS rather than PPC.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem is that advertisers are paying for the wrong thing. Many of the companies and people that place PPC ads don&#8217;t want clicks, they want to sell a product. To eliminate click fraud, stop measuring clicks and start measuring sales. </p>
<p>Yes, pay-per-sale is quite possible. Imagine if Google provided a way for AdWords advertisers to have customers buy using GPay and only pay for the ad if a sale was made. With the ad and payment system integrated, it&#8217;s no problem to track whether clicks resulted in a sale. The Adwords algorithm would change to reflect the click-to-sales effectiveness of the competing bidders rather than the click-to-bid-price.</p>
<p>Why would Google want to give up the sure thing of PPC? First, click fraud is a lot harder to stop than some people think. Google and merchants are losing a lot of money to it, and hand-to-hand combat with offenders is tedious in a market this big. Second, pay-per-sale would not be subject to the 14% (or higher) &#8220;click fraud tax&#8221;. That makes costs lower for Google, the merchant/advertiser, and the customer. The three of them can divide those savings rather than giving them to criminals.</p>
<p>The existence of PPS doesn&#8217;t mean that PPC goes away, because there are some things that can&#8217;t be measured by hard sales. However, if a product *can* be measured by sales it&#8217;s almost a sure bet that it *will* be more efficient to advertise using PPS rather than PPC.</p>
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